The Political Junkie Thread

[Phredd3]

Anyone have any thoughts or predictions for the prime-time January 6th hearings tonight? I don't ever recall a congressional hearing being explicitly scheduled for prime time, and frankly I think it is a mistake to do that. It is a transparent attempt to grab the limelight. On the other hand, maybe that breaks through the Fox noise machine? I'll be curious to see if anything in there moves the needle on our political version of WWI trench warfare.

I disagree wholeheartedly. If the first attempted internal overthrow of our government, by the President no less, isn't worth the limelight, then let's just flush the whole fucking thing down the toilet right now.

To be clear, I'm not suggesting that the event isn't worth the limelight, I'm concerned that the transparent attempt to put it there makes it appear to simply be political theater and makes it easier for entrenched Republicans to simply ignore it. After all, the biggest problem is that only 45% of the public thinks that Trump and their party actually had anything to do with the riot. So the question isn't how much attention does it deserve. The question is what is the best way to break through to entrenched minds?

Of course, there are many who simply cannot be convinced. I'm concerned about making sure this gets through to those who can be.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Anyone have any thoughts or predictions for the prime-time January 6th hearings tonight? I don't ever recall a congressional hearing being explicitly scheduled for prime time, and frankly I think it is a mistake to do that. It is a transparent attempt to grab the limelight. On the other hand, maybe that breaks through the Fox noise machine? I'll be curious to see if anything in there moves the needle on our political version of WWI trench warfare.

I disagree wholeheartedly. If the first attempted internal overthrow of our government, by the President no less, isn't worth the limelight, then let's just flush the whole fucking thing down the toilet right now.

To be clear, I'm not suggesting that the event isn't worth the limelight, I'm concerned that the transparent attempt to put it there makes it appear to simply be political theater and makes it easier for entrenched Republicans to simply ignore it. After all, the biggest problem is that only 45% of the public thinks that Trump and their party actually had anything to do with the riot. So the question isn't how much attention does it deserve. The question is what is the best way to break through to entrenched minds?

Of course, there are many who simply cannot be convinced. I'm concerned about making sure this gets through to those who can be.

I struggle to figure out what the right answer is anymore. If they had their way, we would just ignore it and move on. Which is not the right answer. It has to be perfectly orchestrated. Do not give them anything to latch onto that diverts attention from the key point. Stay completely on message. Don't use this as an excuse to focus on climate change, race relations, Duke's starting shooting guard, or any other topic. Don't let the AOC's of the world hijack this. Run it by people like the Lincoln Project guys (remember them?).

I think most people have their minds made up and those who choose to will just ignore it. I just don't want Fox News saying "the Democrats were ranting and raving about this and Senator XYZ's fly was down - can you believe that?!?" and it ends up on the cover of the NY Post, etc.

Listening to their excuse making about gun regulation literally makes me ill. They have no morals and no soul and can convince themselves of anything. They truly live in an alternate reality.

[dudog]

I don't give a fuck about the 3 million people who watch Tucker and Hannity. They can do a lot of damage, but they are less than 1% of the population. I don't give a fuck if fox news airs the hearings. Most of their viewers would just switch over to a Kardashian show, and there is absolutely nothing you could show them that would make a difference.

I've heard people on both sides complain that it's going to be a show. Well, that's what the American people want. Hasn't that been proven by who they elected 6 years ago?

"The evil was not in bread and circuses, per se, but in the willingness of the people to sell their rights as free men for full bellies and the excitement of the games which would serve to distract them from the other human hungers which bread and circuses can never appease." - Marcus Tullius Cicero

[CrazyNotCrazie]

That was well done. Good idea to have Cheney take such a leading role. Not much of the riot video was new but it was still really powerful. I'm sure the Republicans will claim that the clips of Barr, Ivanka, etc. were taken out of context. All of the Proud Boys and others were saying how Trump had done so much for them. What exactly did he do for them?

I am still waiting for one person to give a decent explanation of why they think the election was stolen - "Trump said it was" does not count. Watching him or someone else stumble through an explanation would make for compelling TV. I will stand by my oft-repeated statement that anyone who still believes that the 2020 election was stolen is not mentally stable and thus should not vote in future elections. That would solve a lot of problems.

My fear is that the Republicans are going to cheat and steal the election in 2024. Then when the Democrats try to complain, the Republicans will say "you wouldn't let us protest the outcome of 2020, so why should you be able to protest the outcome in 2024?"

[dudog]

That was well done. Good idea to have Cheney take such a leading role. Not much of the riot video was new but it was still really powerful. I'm sure the Republicans will claim that the clips of Barr, Ivanka, etc. were taken out of context. All of the Proud Boys and others were saying how Trump had done so much for them. What exactly did he do for them?

I am still waiting for one person to give a decent explanation of why they think the election was stolen - "Trump said it was" does not count. Watching him or someone else stumble through an explanation would make for compelling TV. I will stand by my oft-repeated statement that anyone who still believes that the 2020 election was stolen is not mentally stable and thus should not vote in future elections. That would solve a lot of problems.

My fear is that the Republicans are going to cheat and steal the election in 2024. Then when the Democrats try to complain, the Republicans will say "you wouldn't let us protest the outcome of 2020, so why should you be able to protest the outcome in 2024?"

He helped their recruiting. Their dues-paying membership has increased significantly.

You ain't gonna get it. They're a bunch of whiny bitches. But Ds are supposed to be the snowflakes.

[CameronBornAndBred]

We are camping, with iffy phone signal, so I listened to the first part over the radio and was able to watch the second part streaming. I'm looking forward to the whole of the hearings, but they are obviously going to be lengthy in time and I wonder how long the whole of America is going to "tune in".

[CameronBornAndBred]

Ahhh...it's begun.
Daddy is no longer shining upon his favorite daughter.

"The former president, responding to videotaped testimony played at the Jan. 6 hearing, said Ivanka Trump had been “checked out” and was not involved in studying the election results."

How long do we have until he caves in to his "I hardly know her" go to statement?

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/10/us/p ... aring.html

[OPK]

We are camping, with iffy phone signal, so I listened to the first part over the radio and was able to watch the second part streaming. I'm looking forward to the whole of the hearings, but they are obviously going to be lengthy in time and I wonder how long the whole of America is going to "tune in".

My guess is that the 10 a.m. ones will be designed for good sound bites on the evening news. They are also releasing a lot of the clips on Twitter.

[dudog]

Interview with John Dean on the 50th anniversary of Watergate.

I don’t think you can look at Watergate today without looking at what happened during the Trump years. And that actually makes Richard Nixon look pretty good by comparison. Nixon, it was obvious to me, had a conscience. He experienced shame. Did he abuse power? You bet. But at least he had some internal checks on himself. I’m not sure that Donald Trump does.

I never really felt worried during Watergate that small “d” democracy was in any trouble. But I can tell you, from the time Trump was nominated, until he left, that I had a knot in my stomach. And unfortunately, his departure didn’t end the problems that he triggered, if you will.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics ... li=BBnbfcL

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Once again the Republicans are completely running circles around the Dems. This gun bill that is allegedly approved by the Senate is a joke. It does absolutely nothing. But it allows the Republicans to say "we tried to compromise and we gave in on a few things - aren't we great?" But those things are meaningless and I'm sure the NRA told them exactly what they could give on.

And now everyone will forget about guns until the next batch of kids gets wasted by some nutjob with a Rambo complex and easy access to a gun that no sane human being really needs access to. You do not need one of these weapons of mass destruction to "defend yourself." Look at the laws Canada just passed. We are a joke.

And if it is solely an issue of mental health, how come most of the other countries in the world that have more restrictive gun rules have far fewer mass shootings.

Once again, it is people unwilling to compromise for the greater good. Don't mess with my liberties. Yet ironically this group has a huge overlap with the people who want to infringe on the liberties of a woman who was raped or is having a baby that will be born dead or with huge medical needs to decide what to do with her body. And I also guarantee you that none of them watched the January 6th presentation the other night. Because they are patriots and they know better, because that's what their false messiah Trump told them.

[dudog]

You do not need one of these weapons of mass destruction to "defend yourself."

But then how am I going to kill them varmints in my back yard? (I feel the need for a Bill Murray/Caddyshack reference here)

[Phredd3]

Once again the Republicans are completely running circles around the Dems. This gun bill that is allegedly approved by the Senate is a joke. It does absolutely nothing. But it allows the Republicans to say "we tried to compromise and we gave in on a few things - aren't we great?" But those things are meaningless and I'm sure the NRA told them exactly what they could give on.

As I understand it, the bill isn't actually written yet. To be completely honest, I'm really not sure what's in it and what isn't. It does sound like we will be throwing some money in the general direction of mental health, which is a good thing, even if not truly related to the problem.

At a big picture level, though, my feeling is that passing ANYTHING is a huge breakthrough. Each thing we pass is a step forward, so that the next time this happens, we can move on and close another avenue. It's a shame we have to have more shootings to keep passing restrictions that should already be in place, but each time we move this ball forward, that's a good thing.

Assuming the final result contains more or less the what current reporting says it does, I think tit would be a big win for the Democrats, and if it passes, they should be shouting this from the rooftops. Does it go far enough? Absolutely not. But it does make more progress than we've made in very long time.

Of course, it also hasn't been passed yet. Republicans have given Democrats the head fake before. I'll believe it when I see it.

[CameronBornAndBred]

I watched a good bit of the hearings this morning. I like the way they are doing it, showing the interviews that they've held. I truly do wish that the Republicans could have been more adult about participating on the committee. I'd be interested to hear the questions they'd ask, and and the replies that they get from the witnesses.
In one way, it keeps the Circus Show that the likes of Jim Jordan would be attempting to promote off the floor, but there are members on the GOP side that could have been valid contributors.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Watching a little follow up, and I'm hearing an interesting thought. Is it possible that DJT and his "campaign" committed mail fraud? There was a reason that the hearings today highlighted the creation of his "election defense fund" or whatever it was called, which actually fed barely any money to "election defense" and instead millions towards PACs run by his cronies.

That's some big time "We're gonna bring down Al Capone not with murder but tax violations" scheming right there.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Watching a little follow up, and I'm hearing an interesting thought. Is it possible that DJT and his "campaign" committed mail fraud? There was a reason that the hearings today highlighted the creation of his "election defense fund" or whatever it was called, which actually fed barely any money to "election defense" and instead millions towards PACs run by his cronies.

That's some big time "We're gonna bring down Al Capone not with murder but tax violations" scheming right there.

Thanks for the updates. I'll take whatever will get him, as long as the penalty isn't not financial (because he will sucker all of his followers into paying it for him) but jail time and/or being unable to run for office again. Preferably both. I just hope that Garland is listening as his case is basically being written for him. This is all taking way too long.

Saw your post OY. Hope you and the GF are doing OK!

[CameronBornAndBred]

I just hope that Garland is listening as his case is basically being written for him. This is all taking way too long.

Interestingly, Garland was directly asked if he was, and he answered just as directly that he and the rest of his team were watching all of it. Not necessarily live, but they are watching all of it.

PS, thanks, we ain't dead yet. Not even mostly.

[OPK]

Not sure that getting your blood pressure up is good for your recovery!

(Feel better soon)

[dudog]

I watched a good bit of the hearings this morning. I like the way they are doing it, showing the interviews that they've held. I truly do wish that the Republicans could have been more adult about participating on the committee. I'd be interested to hear the questions they'd ask, and and the replies that they get from the witnesses.
In one way, it keeps the Circus Show that the likes of Jim Jordan would be attempting to promote off the floor, but there are members on the GOP side that could have been valid contributors.

Sorry, gotta disagree. Name one.

And I've been thinking the same about mail fraud, though I think it's called wire fraud in the digital age.

[CameronBornAndBred]

I watched a good bit of the hearings this morning. I like the way they are doing it, showing the interviews that they've held. I truly do wish that the Republicans could have been more adult about participating on the committee. I'd be interested to hear the questions they'd ask, and and the replies that they get from the witnesses.
In one way, it keeps the Circus Show that the likes of Jim Jordan would be attempting to promote off the floor, but there are members on the GOP side that could have been valid contributors.

Sorry, gotta disagree. Name one.

And I've been thinking the same about mail fraud, though I think it's called wire fraud in the digital age.

There are plenty of GOP members not seeking the limelight in the way that Goetz, Jordan, Gosar, etc do.
In fact it's the ones that I DON'T know that I'd like to see on the committee.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Going back to the "Legal Defense Fund" thing. I remember quite vividly that this scam was talked about A LOT in real time. It was in story after story how it was very obvious that most of this "fund" money was going to Trump & Friends' PACs.

And even then, seeing that the scam was out in the wide open, those folks still hawked it. I never thought back then that it would be the means to ultimate justice, and obviously none of the crooks did either.

Today, I'm sitting here with widening eyes. Mine are wide out of amazement and curiosity that someone actually has something pinnable.
Theirs are wide out of "Oh fuck" fear. I'm pretty sure that we'll be seeing upcoming subpoenas and interviews from the DOJ, and they won't be starting at the top. While they need to be thorough, they also better be expedient. Tick tock.