crazietalk.net

So I've pretty much decided that I am sick to death of doing my PhD (I finished my comps a while ago and am currently ABD). I really don't have the motivation anymore, especially because the job market for academics sucks. Schools, at least here in Canada, are increasing their graduate enrollment (because they get more government funding for every grad student - perhaps your state schools are doing something similar) while jobs are disappearing. I cannot see myself being an adjunct and, even if I managed to get a tenure stream job, I cannot see myself going through all of the crap involved in gaining tenure. The latest figures I saw (for 2005) show that there are 12,264 history PhDs in program in North America. There definitely aren't 12,264 jobs out there for us. Plus, undergrad students are depressing because few of them care the way I think a student should - they just want their degree so that they can go out and get a job.

The problem is that I have no idea what else I want to do - it's not like a Master's in history translates well to other careers. I would love to stay in academia, perhaps as an administrator of some description, but schools around here aren't hiring as much as they used to because of the economy. In a perfect world I'd move to London (or elsewhere in Britain) but, because of family obligations, I can't do that right now - to say nothing of the fact that they are being hit harder by this recession than Canada is.

So, right now, I'm sitting here drinking trying to figure out what to do with my life. I'm also just rambling and inflicting my soul-searching on the rest of you - for that I apologise.

colchar wrote: So, right now, I'm sitting here drinking trying to figure out what to do with my life. I'm also just rambling and inflicting my soul-searching on the rest of you - for that I apologise.

That's awesome. Tomorrow, I'll actually post something more substantial. But tonight I'm getting ready for 10PM. In the mean time, I can say all will turn out alright, and you will at some point be doing what suits you best. I'll expand more tomorrow.

You could always go to law school.

CathyCA wrote:You could always go to law school.

I'd thought of that before grad school and decided it wasn't for me. Had I known though, I would've gone to law school.

Colchar,
Yes, substantial posts tomorrow are in order. I, like CBaB, am still celebrating the 10PM toast (a Yeti), but I must admit... I feel your pain.

In the meantime, there is but one question;
Do you love working, researching, and writing your topic?

Shove the future job issue to the side while you answer that question.

Cheers,
Lavabe

Lavabe wrote:
In the meantime, there is but one question;
Do you love working, researching, and writing your topic?

In all honestly, no. I was enthused about it when I started but am less and less so now. In a nutshell (and my apologies for copying and pasting this from a PM between myself and another poster earlier today) my dissertation looks at British intelligence in sub-Saharan Africa during the Cold War - basically the actions of Britain's intelligence agencies with regards to African nationalist groups (the official British government position was NIMAR - No Independence without Majority African Rule but the intelligence agencies were conducting extensive surveillance operations against these groups and their leaders) and their fear of communist influence (Russian, Chinese, Cuban, etc.) during the retreat from empire.

My interests have changed - drastically. I am now far more interested in the urban history of London in the 19th and 20th centuries than anything else (some former profs of mine might be somewhat shocked to hear of my interest in urban history). I know I can finish the PhD and then go off an do whatever I like with regards to research but I am really not sure I have the stomach for playing the academic game any longer. You're teaching now so I'm sure you know what I am talking about. I love the teaching aspect of being a prof but am no longer interested in everything else that comes with it (the quest for tenure, etc.).

I've got a committee meeting later this month and am very tempted to either cancel it and just quit or to go in and tell them that I'm done - I just don't have it any more. Figures I'd be at this point during the worst economic situation in decades...

I'm really at a crossroads here (and of course am drunkenly rambling and posting about it).

colchar wrote:
I've got a committee meeting later this month and am very tempted to either cancel it and just quit or to go in and tell them that I'm done - I just don't have it any more. Figures I'd be at this point during the worst economic situation in decades...

I'm really at a crossroads here (and of course am drunkenly rambling and posting about it).

Once again, I'll contribute more tomorrow, but I'm more concerned now so I have more to think about as I head off to bed. Maybe what you (Maybe nothing, we have pinned your source of insomnia) are unsure of is not an uncertainty, but an inner voice telling you to stop now and do something else. That's it. I'm off to bed, because if I address what you are thinking about I'll be up late myself. Drink up tonight, have fun, and listen to yourself. You already know you are going to be involved in something else other than what you figured was your chosen path. There is no right or wrong in that choice. The hard part is accepting it.

Damn we need a philosophy phorum.

colchar wrote: I've got a committee meeting later this month and am very tempted to either cancel it and just quit or to go in and tell them that I'm done - I just don't have it any more. Figures I'd be at this point during the worst economic situation in decades...

Whatever you decide to do, don't throw away this semester's work. Finish it out so you can come back and pick up where you left, without having to "redo" what you've already done. Maybe you'll never want to come back to it, but at least you'll have that option.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

colchar wrote:My interests have changed - drastically. I am now far more interested in the urban history of London in the 19th and 20th centuries than anything else (some former profs of mine might be somewhat shocked to hear of my interest in urban history). I know I can finish the PhD and then go off an do whatever I like with regards to research but I am really not sure I have the stomach for playing the academic game any longer. You're teaching now so I'm sure you know what I am talking about. I love the teaching aspect of being a prof but am no longer interested in everything else that comes with it (the quest for tenure, etc.).

I feel for you, colchar. Several thoughts:
1) The tenure or lectureship demands vary with each position out there. I was raised in two top tier research institutes, and worked in another one, before finding this position (a large regional university), where the tenure demands emphasize strongly the teaching. Each position will be different. Research institutes have extremely high publishing demands, and that may be what you are referencing. Liberal arts colleges have other demands. Regional universities are also different.
2) Professional academic meetings are important for grad students to attend, particularly so that you can see the scope of positions and responsibilities elsewhere. Also, meetings usually contain symposia on "where the jobs are" or "so you're a grad student... what next?"
3) Perhaps your university/grad school also has counseling facilities that deal precisely your issue. Many do.
4) My colleague in history reports that in the US, at least, foreign history folks are higher in demand than are US history folks, right now. But NO oNE can predict what will be the effect of the hiring freezes that are sweeping across the nation.
5) If you start to recognize some health issues surfacing (insomnia, blood pressure, digestion, anxiety/panic attacks, etc...), please see a medical doctor for an exam.
6) Set up a diss writing club with someone else in your department who is also trying to write the diss. Usually, two people working like this will spur forth progress better than will two individuals facing things alone.

The best solution is to get writing the diss, regardless of the future issues.
Cheers,
Lavabe

Sorry for the delayed response, I was off at my parent's place yesterday for Easter dinner.

Lavabe wrote:
I feel for you, colchar. Several thoughts:
1) The tenure or lectureship demands vary with each position out there. I was raised in two top tier research institutes, and worked in another one, before finding this position (a large regional university), where the tenure demands emphasize strongly the teaching. Each position will be different. Research institutes have extremely high publishing demands, and that may be what you are referencing. Liberal arts colleges have other demands. Regional universities are also different.

I realize that smaller schools, or less research intensive large ones, will have different criteria. While I enjoy parts of teaching, I also find some of it very frustrating - students who just don't care, lack of effort on their part, too much effort on my part for too little return (ie. explaining things countless times yet having students keep making the same basic mistakes over and over again).

3) Perhaps your university/grad school also has counseling facilities that deal precisely your issue. Many do.

I hadn't thought of that. It's a great suggestion and I'll look into it.

4) My colleague in history reports that in the US, at least, foreign history folks are higher in demand than are US history folks, right now. But NO oNE can predict what will be the effect of the hiring freezes that are sweeping across the nation.

I mentioned earlier in this thread the number of history PhDs in program right now (in North America) and the numbers are depressing (not to mention increasing). But the number that depresses me most is that between 1990 and 2004 only 32% of those who earned PhDs in history found jobs in history departments. Those are some scary figures.

5) If you start to recognize some health issues surfacing (insomnia, blood pressure, digestion, anxiety/panic attacks, etc...), please see a medical doctor for an exam.

Another good idea. I've got one scheduled for later this week.

6) Set up a diss writing club with someone else in your department who is also trying to write the diss. Usually, two people working like this will spur forth progress better than will two individuals facing things alone.

Yet another good idea. I'll speak to the other members of my cohort (one of who has done all of her degrees with me and, more importantly, was my roommate for almost two years).

It seems I'm not the only one with this issue. While on campus today I found out that three other PhD candidates have quit, or are about to quit, the program. And a couple of these are really surprising as they were two of the best students in the program - I was shocked when I found out they were out or on their way out.

colchar wrote:It seems I'm not the only one with this issue. While on campus today I found out that three other PhD candidates have quit, or are about to quit, the program. And a couple of these are really surprising as they were two of the best students in the program - I was shocked when I found out they were out or on their way out.

Would people be shocked if you quit? That's an honest question you should consider and what the implications of the answer are.

And how, if at all, does the departures mentioned above impact your status within the program?

colchar wrote:It seems I'm not the only one with this issue. While on campus today I found out that three other PhD candidates have quit, or are about to quit, the program. And a couple of these are really surprising as they were two of the best students in the program - I was shocked when I found out they were out or on their way out.

I am very glad that you are researching this thoroughly. Grad school can be a very lonely trial (speaking from experience) ... but I think you may have a great opportunity where you are, especially if you coordinate with resources at your university. I had a close friend quit the program I was in, and it sounds like for very similar reasons to yours. I'd hate if you made a decision without exploring all of your options where you are. Ozzie's post makes a LOT of sense.

And don't just form a diss group within your department. Sometimes forming a partnership with someone outside your department can really make you become much more productive... and have a healthier perspective. I know it helped me out.

Of all the issues you mention, the BIGGEST concern, of course, is with your health, both mental and physical.

Cheers,
Lavabe

OZZIE4DUKE wrote: Would people be shocked if you quit? That's an honest question you should consider and what the implications of the answer are.

Some would be, others wouldn't be.

And how, if at all, does the departures mentioned above impact your status within the program?

It doesn't have any effect on me at all. Competition for scholarships might become a bit easier but that's about it.

There is a professor in my department with whom I get along rather well - because we share a connection to Duke basketball (I had run into him one day while wearing a Duke jacket and asked him to open the main office for me because I had to get something from my mailbox and he replied that, while wearing that jacket, I could ask him for any favour I wanted - it was then that I remembered that he had attended Duke for his PhD as a James B. Duke Commonwealth Scholar and was a basketball fanatic). I think I am going to sit down with him to talk this through because, as the former Dean of Graduate Studies, he would probably be the best person to help me figure this out. I'll try to catch him Thursday and I'll see how our chat goes.

colchar wrote: I think I am going to sit down with him to talk this through because, as the former Dean of Graduate Studies, he would probably be the best person to help me figure this out. I'll try to catch him Thursday and I'll see how our chat goes.

Excellent plan, Colchar. Far better than asking us for guidance!

Sorry I can't offer any advice colchar. But hey, I'm always here if you wanna bitch about it. That's what eFriends are for.

Maybe you need a vacation in.. Florida?

WindsorsDaughter wrote:Maybe you need a vacation in.. Florida?

Listen, once you two announce your engagement, remember who (plural, and from a certain crazie board) should be invited... and I assume it's a given that the color will be Duke blue?

Sue71 wrote:

WindsorsDaughter wrote:Maybe you need a vacation in.. Florida?

Listen, once you two announce your engagement, remember who (plural, and from a certain crazie board) should be invited... and I assume it's a given that the color will be Duke blue?

As mother of the bride I can assure all the logical suspects will be invited...move over brunchgate...here comes WEDDINGGATE!