Tiger

Miles · Post by **Miles** » December 11th, 2009, 8:05 am

rockymtn devil wrote:
Miles wrote: Many people I've read or heard speaking, claim that Tiger's right to privacy ends when he leaves his own home, most then follow-up with some bullshit logic that he's a superstar and he asked for this. Sorry folks but that is complete crap. I may not be a lawyer, so I'm not familiar with any precedents out there but I'm pretty sure the Supreme Court would disagree with anyone that says his right to privacy ends when he leaves his home. If the expectation of privacy ends when someone steps outside the walls of their home, then what is left? Do we mean then that peoples' thoughts, beliefs and feelings are only sacred when they're at home? Does that mean that I have the right to eavesdrop on every conversation someone has and ask them probing questions about what they're doing, what they're thinking and who they're talking to? The answer is no.
Cathy covered this pretty well, so I'll just add a quick thought. The entirety of the Constitution, and the rights we as individuals derive from it--including the right to privacy--rests on one underlying principal that is missing from this analysis: the State Action Doctrine.

The Constitution protects individuals from governmental entities. It does not protect us from private entities, including the media. For example: if people are protesting something on my front yard, I'm free to tell them to get the hell off my property. Why is this not a violation of their 1st Amendment rights? Because I'm not the government and the 1st Amendment doesn't protect them from me. The Constitution limits only governmental conduct (with the possible exception of the 13th Amendment).

With respect to Tiger (or anyone), the right to privacy relates government intervention into our lives and not intrusion by private entities (other laws, such as trespassing prohibitions, may operate in that function). That isn't to say, however, that basic moral ideals shouldn't prevent certain levels of privacy from being invaded.

And the answer to your question at the end of the post is yes. Do you have to answer? No. But that's different.

Very well put. I hadn't thought of the right to privacy that way. I stand corrected.

It is a horrible reason to justify the way we treat celebrities. I still fail to see what Tiger has done to warrant intrusion into his personal life. I feel like all have the right to inspect, analyze, critique the merits of his accomplishments on the golf course, and activities surrounding golf but once it has NOTHING to do with golf, then we have no right to know. Let's just call a spade a spade here. Our fascination with this matter has very little to do with Tiger's score or how he will perform for the remainder of his career, it has everything to do with satisfying our lust for rich and famous.

TillyGalore · Post by **TillyGalore** » December 11th, 2009, 8:36 am

Miles wrote:Very well put. I hadn't thought of the right to privacy that way. I stand corrected.

It is a horrible reason to justify the way we treat celebrities. I still fail to see what Tiger has done to warrant intrusion into his personal life. I feel like all have the right to inspect, analyze, critique the merits of his accomplishments on the golf course, and activities surrounding golf but once it has NOTHING to do with golf, then we have no right to know. Let's just call a spade a spade here. Our fascination with this matter has very little to do with Tiger's score or how he will perform for the remainder of his career, it has everything to do with satisfying our lust for rich and famous.

I liken Tiger's situation to the proverbial couple we all know who really seems to have it going. If John and Jane Doe appear to have the perfect relationship, the perfect job, essentially the perfect life. When they fall, we want to know what happened, we really do want the salacious details about how one has been living a double life. When the "perfect" people screw up, it makes us feel better about our own lives. The only difference between Tiger and the Doe's, is that Tiger's screw ups are played out in the media, whereas the Doe's typically aren't.

As sad as our fascination seems to be, it really is human nature. I'm not saying I agree with it, I'm just recognizing it for what it is.

Miles · Post by **Miles** » December 11th, 2009, 10:17 am

TillyGalore wrote:
Miles wrote:Very well put. I hadn't thought of the right to privacy that way. I stand corrected.

It is a horrible reason to justify the way we treat celebrities. I still fail to see what Tiger has done to warrant intrusion into his personal life. I feel like all have the right to inspect, analyze, critique the merits of his accomplishments on the golf course, and activities surrounding golf but once it has NOTHING to do with golf, then we have no right to know. Let's just call a spade a spade here. Our fascination with this matter has very little to do with Tiger's score or how he will perform for the remainder of his career, it has everything to do with satisfying our lust for rich and famous.
I liken Tiger's situation to the proverbial couple we all know who really seems to have it going. If John and Jane Doe appear to have the perfect relationship, the perfect job, essentially the perfect life. When they fall, we want to know what happened, we really do want the salacious details about how one has been living a double life. When the "perfect" people screw up, it makes us feel better about our own lives. The only difference between Tiger and the Doe's, is that Tiger's screw ups are played out in the media, whereas the Doe's typically aren't.

As sad as our fascination seems to be, it really is human nature. I'm not saying I agree with it, I'm just recognizing it for what it is.

Right on Tilly. I agree with your assessment. I can't judge people for having the fascination, but I am judging them for demanding access to his private life and claiming it IS THEIR RIGHT to know. I find the logic behind that alarming.

TillyGalore · Post by **TillyGalore** » December 11th, 2009, 10:21 am

Miles wrote:
TillyGalore wrote:I liken Tiger's situation to the proverbial couple we all know who really seems to have it going. If John and Jane Doe appear to have the perfect relationship, the perfect job, essentially the perfect life. When they fall, we want to know what happened, we really do want the salacious details about how one has been living a double life. When the "perfect" people screw up, it makes us feel better about our own lives. The only difference between Tiger and the Doe's, is that Tiger's screw ups are played out in the media, whereas the Doe's typically aren't.

As sad as our fascination seems to be, it really is human nature. I'm not saying I agree with it, I'm just recognizing it for what it is.
Right on Tilly. I agree with your assessment. I can't judge people for having the fascination, but I am judging them for demanding access to his private life and claiming it IS THEIR RIGHT to know. I find the logic behind that alarming.

You're right, people don't have a right to info about his private life.

Tiger doesn't owe Tilly any explanations. He only owes explanations to his family, specifically his wife.

Miles · Post by **Miles** » December 11th, 2009, 10:33 am

TillyGalore wrote:
Miles wrote:
TillyGalore wrote:I liken Tiger's situation to the proverbial couple we all know who really seems to have it going. If John and Jane Doe appear to have the perfect relationship, the perfect job, essentially the perfect life. When they fall, we want to know what happened, we really do want the salacious details about how one has been living a double life. When the "perfect" people screw up, it makes us feel better about our own lives. The only difference between Tiger and the Doe's, is that Tiger's screw ups are played out in the media, whereas the Doe's typically aren't.

As sad as our fascination seems to be, it really is human nature. I'm not saying I agree with it, I'm just recognizing it for what it is.
Right on Tilly. I agree with your assessment. I can't judge people for having the fascination, but I am judging them for demanding access to his private life and claiming it IS THEIR RIGHT to know. I find the logic behind that alarming.
You're right, people don't have a right to info about his private life.

Tiger doesn't owe Tilly any explanations. He only owes explanations to his family, specifically his wife.

Dern skippy he does!

CathyCA · Post by **CathyCA** » December 11th, 2009, 11:26 am

Miles wrote:
TillyGalore wrote:
Miles wrote:Very well put. I hadn't thought of the right to privacy that way. I stand corrected.

It is a horrible reason to justify the way we treat celebrities. I still fail to see what Tiger has done to warrant intrusion into his personal life. I feel like all have the right to inspect, analyze, critique the merits of his accomplishments on the golf course, and activities surrounding golf but once it has NOTHING to do with golf, then we have no right to know. Let's just call a spade a spade here. Our fascination with this matter has very little to do with Tiger's score or how he will perform for the remainder of his career, it has everything to do with satisfying our lust for rich and famous.
I liken Tiger's situation to the proverbial couple we all know who really seems to have it going. If John and Jane Doe appear to have the perfect relationship, the perfect job, essentially the perfect life. When they fall, we want to know what happened, we really do want the salacious details about how one has been living a double life. When the "perfect" people screw up, it makes us feel better about our own lives. The only difference between Tiger and the Doe's, is that Tiger's screw ups are played out in the media, whereas the Doe's typically aren't.

As sad as our fascination seems to be, it really is human nature. I'm not saying I agree with it, I'm just recognizing it for what it is.
Right on Tilly. I agree with your assessment. I can't judge people for having the fascination, but I am judging them for demanding access to his private life and claiming it IS THEIR RIGHT to know. I find the logic behind that alarming.

I feel like I'm being bombarded with Tiger's personal life. There was a woman who went on the Today Show this morning and told waaaaaaaaaay TMI.

If she were pretty or had an engaging personality, I might have a better understanding into why he cheated. Maybe she is especially talented at sucking golf balls through drinking straws. Who knows?

Tiger isn't thinking with his driver or his putter--or his wallet. These indiscretions are bound to take a toll on his game, and therefore, on his endorsements and income. I cannot imagine that he can compartmentalize his life so as to ignore all of the reminders of his extramarital escapades once he's back on the links.

Another thing I wonder about is why it took so long for all of these women to come out of the woodwork. I think I'm amazed that Tiger was able to keep his dalliances private for as long as he did. To be sure, others on the PGA or affiliated with the tour were familiar with Tiger's penchant for women other than his wife.

TillyGalore · Post by **TillyGalore** » December 11th, 2009, 11:46 am

CathyCA wrote:I feel like I'm being bombarded with Tiger's personal life. There was a woman who went on the Today Show this morning and told waaaaaaaaaay TMI.

If she were pretty or had an engaging personality, I might have a better understanding into why he cheated. Maybe she is especially talented at sucking golf balls through drinking straws. Who knows?

Tiger isn't thinking with his driver or his putter--or his wallet. These indiscretions are bound to take a toll on his game, and therefore, on his endorsements and income. I cannot imagine that he can compartmentalize his life so as to ignore all of the reminders of his extramarital escapades once he's back on the links.

Another thing I wonder about is why it took so long for all of these women to come out of the woodwork. I think I'm amazed that Tiger was able to keep his dalliances private for as long as he did. To be sure, others on the PGA or affiliated with the tour were familiar with Tiger's penchant for women other than his wife.

I agree, Cathy, we are being bombarded from all angles. The Mike&Mike show on ESPN brings it up too, though they don't dwell on it.

Johnboy · Post by **Johnboy** » December 11th, 2009, 12:40 pm

CathyCA wrote: I feel like I'm being bombarded with Tiger's personal life. There was a woman who went on the Today Show this morning and told waaaaaaaaaay TMI.

If she were pretty or had an engaging personality, I might have a better understanding into why he cheated. Maybe she is especially talented at sucking golf balls through drinking straws. Who knows?

I usually watch the beginning of the Today Show. This morning, when they showed the bimbo and said they were going to interview her, I changed the channel. I might just make Good Morning America my usual morning 10 minutes of TV. This woman should be shamed and shunned, not made famous. Ugh.

So . . . exactly what did she say? <--joke! ;)

Lavabe · Post by **Lavabe** » December 12th, 2009, 8:15 am

Tiger is taking an indefinite leave from the golf tour.

I guess that means another 6 months of economic recession.

Post by **YmoBeThere** » December 12th, 2009, 12:54 pm

Lavabe wrote:Tiger is taking an indefinite leave from the golf tour.

I guess that means another 6 months of economic recession.

I can't help but think that golf is still in a decline. It peaked sometime late in the 90's by my estimation but I don't have any evidence. I'm sure the PGA or some other group keeps a tally on rounds played every year. Is it soon to be relegated to the same status as bowling? Or will it fall further than that and share space with roller skating?

bjornolf · Post by **bjornolf** » December 12th, 2009, 2:47 pm

I think that part of the problem is that he has set himself up, through his endorsement deals and whatnot, as a role model to many people. Many athletes say "I'm not a role model", but he's not one of them. From his clean cut image to his conditioning and discipline to his excellence in his sport to the types of items he endorses to his "perfect" home life, he's become the prototype for the American dream, for lack of a better term, the perfect role model for kids and adults alike. When that American dream crumbles before our very eyes, people will be fascinated, and horrified, kind of like the car wreck you just can't tear your eyes away from.

Miles · Post by **Miles** » December 12th, 2009, 4:51 pm

bjornolf wrote:I think that part of the problem is that he has set himself up, through his endorsement deals and whatnot, as a role model to many people. Many athletes say "I'm not a role model", but he's not one of them. From his clean cut image to his conditioning and discipline to his excellence in his sport to the types of items he endorses to his "perfect" home life, he's become the prototype for the American dream, for lack of a better term, the perfect role model for kids and adults alike. When that American dream crumbles before our very eyes, people will be fascinated, and horrified, kind of like the car wreck you just can't tear your eyes away from.

Great analogy! I'm disgusted by rubber-neckers too!

bjornolf · Post by **bjornolf** » December 13th, 2009, 7:23 am

I was listening to the radio the other day, and they had a guy on who said he sent out his college essays two weeks ago. In the common application essay about your role model, he picked Tiger. He was saying what an idiot he felt like, and how he probably wasn't going to get into those schools now. I'm sure that's not true, since he could just explain that he submitted them before all this happened, and he might even get a sympathy vote if he articulately explains how Tiger has betrayed that trust and who his role model is now.

That's a PERFECT example of what I was talking about though.

Miles · Post by **Miles** » December 13th, 2009, 8:00 am

bjornolf wrote:I was listening to the radio the other day, and they had a guy on who said he sent out his college essays two weeks ago. In the common application essay about your role model, he picked Tiger. He was saying what an idiot he felt like, and how he probably wasn't going to get into those schools now. I'm sure that's not true, since he could just explain that he submitted them before all this happened, and he might even get a sympathy vote if he articulately explains how Tiger has betrayed that trust and who his role model is now.

That's a PERFECT example of what I was talking about though.

How curious is it that we pick total strangers as role models? Sure, Tiger is a master and his dedication to his sport is impressive, maybe even inspiring, but those qualities along aren't enough to warrant role model status. I feel bad for that guy, but not because Tiger Woods ended up being a supreme douchebag. I feel bad for that guy because he had not other man in his life to serve as a role model. I got lucky, damn lucky, because I have an amazing father who is and will always be my role model. He's not perfect, but he is the most complete man I know and I'm honored to model some of my behavior and principles after him.

Maybe Americans can wake up and smell the coffee; billionaires, celebrities, athletes, and total strangers make horrible role models.

Very Duke Blue · Post by **Very Duke Blue** » December 13th, 2009, 11:59 am

i am sooo tired of tiger even if he may have figured out he screwed up his life.

devildeac · Post by **devildeac** » December 13th, 2009, 12:32 pm

I am shocked, simply shocked that no one has started a "Tiger Jokes" thread either here or over yonder. Just sayin'... ;) :roll:

TillyGalore · Post by **TillyGalore** » December 13th, 2009, 5:02 pm

devildeac wrote:I am shocked, simply shocked that no one has started a "Tiger Jokes" thread either here or over yonder. Just sayin'... ;) :roll:

Why wood anyone do that?

Post by **YmoBeThere** » December 13th, 2009, 5:50 pm

TillyGalore wrote:
devildeac wrote:I am shocked, simply shocked that no one has started a "Tiger Jokes" thread either here or over yonder. Just sayin'... ;) :roll:
Why wood anyone do that?

I think everyone is exhausted with Tiger...

devildeac · Post by **devildeac** » December 13th, 2009, 5:54 pm

YmoBeThere wrote:
TillyGalore wrote:
devildeac wrote:I am shocked, simply shocked that no one has started a "Tiger Jokes" thread either here or over yonder. Just sayin'... ;) :roll:
Why wood anyone do that?
I think everyone is exhausted with Tiger...

But think about the wealth of material and # of posts you could compose.

knights68 · Post by **knights68** » December 13th, 2009, 6:03 pm

devildeac wrote:I am shocked, simply shocked that no one has started a "Tiger Jokes" thread either here or over yonder. Just sayin'... ;) :roll:

Did you hear Tiger changed his name to Cheetah?

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