The Job Search Thread

[lawgrad91]

AD, thanks for the update. It sounds like a fun group.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Dinner was fun, and I didn't spill any red sauce on my red shirt. These people are fun! The crew consisted of me, the two people who want to hire me, and 2 department chairs (one of which is the one who wants to give me a tenure track position). Definitely a collegial group.

Regarding the faculty position, rumor has it that there's not an official position yet. That's part of the reason I was thinking about coming in and then going into the tenure track position. I definitely need to get more info about the department, and I didn't meet the dean. I did like the department chair, though, and I like his philosophy. As I suspected, there's a substantial gap between what they can offer and what I'm making now ($20k). It will be interesting to see what happens.

Just to be clear, the low offer ($20K below your current salary) is for the senior scientist job you went to interview for and not the faculty/tenure track job that is ALSO being offered to you? Or was the original job just a ruse to get you there and there is only one job offer on the table? Would the faculty job, if it is a different opportunity, carry a higher salary? Inquiring (nosy) minds want to know!

[ArkieDukie]

Lower salary is for the job I interviewed for. I think they may try to work some magic, though. They really want me here.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Lower salary is for the job I interviewed for. I think they may try to work some magic, though. They really want me here.

It's nice to be wanted! Really REALLY nice!

Today is the first day of the rest of your life!

There is magic in the air. It's that time of year!

[Very Duke Blue]

Yippee!! Ozzie is right. Magic is in the air.

[windsor]

Take the tenure track position. I expect those don't come along every day. This is an opportunity that can not be taken lightly.

My limitted knowledge of the academic world leads me to believe it will be far easier to return to research from the tenure position than it might be to get a tenure position after you've 'established yourself. There is no shame in saying 'tried it, didn't like it'.

A few years back I phased into project management from software development. Dumb idea. Hated it. My heart is in the code...so I went back...not sorry I took the PM gig when it was offered, and I had no problem switching back with a simple "thought I wanted to...tried it, don't like it...want to go back to what I love )

As the rest of the troops have said...do not sell yourself short TAKE THE POSITION. Visualize PHB's face when he finds out ...visualize minions face

Seriously, if you can make hte $$ work...take it and run

[Lavabe]

The questions I suggested really give them the indication that you want to be there... without committing you definitively. It is VERY critical that you find out:
1) Is the dean on board with this plan for t-track, or is this simply a chair who wants to get this through? HOW FAR ALONG IN THE PROCESS IS THE TENURE-TRACK? If the dean is on board, what exactly is the process and timetable before this position gets finalized? THIS IS THE BIG QUESTION.

2) Are you a replacement hire? If so, who was there before you, and why is that person no longer there? Again, what's been a history of the place in the last 5 years? How has administration changed in the same time?

3) What's the housing market like there? Can any of them offer you a trusted realtor whom you could ask regarding the market? They will LOVE it if you ask this question.

Just some thoughts.
Cheers,
Lava-"Vibing Away"-be

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

There's superb advice in the comments on this thread.

Don't sell yourself short..... this tendency may have been reinforced by the climate in your current workplace.

Step away from undervaluing yourself and embrace how magnificent it is that you are in a position to consider an unexpected offer on the tenure track. Try to look at all aspects as objectively as possible and remember that you are indeed worthy of such an opportunity now.

[IowaDevil]

Wow! Been out of CTN touch for a few days and look what you've done! So happy to hearball the positive news!

[ArkieDukie]

Can't remember if I mentioned this earlier, but a head hunter contacted me again for a position with a company in SoCal that designs medical diagnostic tests. I had a phone interview with them on Thursday. The hiring manager likes my background, so I think I have a good chance for an on-site interview. If it happens, it wouldn't be until after January 1.

I came away from the phone interview more excited than I was going in. This could be a good gig. The cost of living is high in SoCal, but I suspect I'd be making well into 6 figures. Not everyone has my peculiar set of skills, and it happens to be a skill set that's highly valued by the company that's looking to hire. And, if I take this job, it would basically make me an even more valuable commodity should I decide to move on in the future.

PHB doesn't value my skills because, I've learned, he believes in lowering the accepted reporting criteria in our field in order to give collaborators the answer they want. He actually said this in a recent departmental seminar. The quality (or even correctness) of the answer doesn't matter as long as it's the answer they're looking for. He's basically dumbing down the lab right now, promoting people who don't know what they're doing so they'll blindly say whatever he wants them to say. I'm pretty sure now that this is why I was left off the cancer project. All the people who were included are willing to support questionable results, in large part because they don't know any better. Recall that my boss also believes in throwing people under the bus to make himself look better. This means that someone else (NuBarbie? ) will be blamed if PHB's practices result in erroneous results being presented to the funding agency. I've already demonstrated that I will not stand by quietly, which makes me a political liability in his eyes. End result? I now know to look for a position where my coworkers believe in high data quality. It looks like I have 2 possibilities.

[shereec]

How exciting! Choices are good. I hope it turns out that you do have to weigh opposing offers, and I like the way you're thinking about your own value. Good luck!

[lawgrad91]

Can't remember if I mentioned this earlier, but a head hunter contacted me again for a position with a company in SoCal that designs medical diagnostic tests. I had a phone interview with them on Thursday. The hiring manager likes my background, so I think I have a good chance for an on-site interview. If it happens, it wouldn't be until after January 1.

I came away from the phone interview more excited than I was going in. This could be a good gig. The cost of living is high in SoCal, but I suspect I'd be making well into 6 figures. Not everyone has my peculiar set of skills, and it happens to be a skill set that's highly valued by the company that's looking to hire. And, if I take this job, it would basically make me an even more valuable commodity should I decide to move on in the future.

AD, this is terrific! Vibes for a new job in the New Year!

[Ima Facultiwyfe]

Wow! Just WOW! When it rains, it pours!!!! So proud of you, smarty pants!!!! Don't make a decision 'til you have to.

Love, Ima

[DukePA]

Go AD!!!! As others have stated, I am so proud of you!!!

[ArkieDukie]

Go AD!!!! As others have stated, I am so proud of you!!!

Thanks, DPA! I'm proud of you, too!

Just got off the phone with potential future colleague at UTMB. They were afraid they couldn't get me to come there due to the huge difference in salary between what I'm making now and what they can offer. They're in the process of adding a faculty-type position (not sure if it's tenure track or not) position for me, but that could take a while. Brave soul that I am, I told him that I am not opposed to taking a cut in salary with the chance of promotion later, and that money was less important to me than good science. I think I surprised him a bit. The deal is, the position that's being added may not let me do stuff I'm really interested in scientifically, but I can see myself fitting in well there. I'm interested in working out something that lets all parties involved come out ahead, but I also recognize that I still need to look out for #1.

The other thing I learned is that my potential future colleague/boss has also been bitten before by taking a position with a promise of something tenure track in the future - to the tune of 17 years (!) in his previous position. I left UAMS after the first time they screwed me over; I only lasted 5 years. (Short story: became co-director of med biochem with promise of tenure track position and course directorship. They gave course directorship to an assistant prof and told him that it would look good for him when he went up for tenure, but it wasn't a lot of work b/c I did most of it. I saw the writing on the wall and chose to exit stage left.) So, I could be taking a huge leap of faith here with an institution that likes me enough to try to add a faculty position for me. Personally, I see that as an improvement over a position where I've been demoted to glorified secretary.

[captmojo]

It's nice to be wanted.

[TillyGalore]

Go AD!!!! As others have stated, I am so proud of you!!!

Thanks, DPA! I'm proud of you, too!

Just got off the phone with potential future colleague at UTMB. They were afraid they couldn't get me to come there due to the huge difference in salary between what I'm making now and what they can offer. They're in the process of adding a faculty-type position (not sure if it's tenure track or not) position for me, but that could take a while. Brave soul that I am, I told him that I am not opposed to taking a cut in salary with the chance of promotion later, and that money was less important to me than good science. I think I surprised him a bit. The deal is, the position that's being added may not let me do stuff I'm really interested in scientifically, but I can see myself fitting in well there. I'm interested in working out something that lets all parties involved come out ahead, but I also recognize that I still need to look out for #1.

The other thing I learned is that my potential future colleague/boss has also been bitten before by taking a position with a promise of something tenure track in the future - to the tune of 17 years (!) in his previous position. I left UAMS after the first time they screwed me over; I only lasted 5 years. (Short story: became co-director of med biochem with promise of tenure track position and course directorship. They gave course directorship to an assistant prof and told him that it would look good for him when he went up for tenure, but it wasn't a lot of work b/c I did most of it. I saw the writing on the wall and chose to exit stage left.) So, I could be taking a huge leap of faith here with an institution that likes me enough to try to add a faculty position for me. Personally, I see that as an improvement over a position where I've been demoted to glorified secretary.

I can be a huge pessimist at times,just ask K68. I wasn't part of your conversation with your future colleague/boss thus know I am not speaking with any authority whatsoever. That noted, it always concerns me when someone has a "similar" experience, especially if they knew about your bad experience first. They may be trying to empathize with you to lure you in, then show their true colors. You know, the ole switch and bait.

I am not saying this is happening here, I really hope it isn't. I just needed to share the pessimistic side of thinking here.

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

I have a little be of a job thing going myself. I'm applying for a job running the internal medicine residency program at Duke. This program is the largest graduate medical education program at Duke. While I love Surgery, sometimes you need to let go. This new position would be working with just one program instead of trying to manage 4-5. There is a lot of work involved with this, but again, one program. I know the hiring manager, and have known him almost the whole time I've been at Duke and have a really good rapport with him. Will be updating my resume this weekend so I can submit it next week and will be having lunch with the gal who is leaving the position (she saw an opportunity for growth and took it, much like how I'm viewing this) to talk about the good and bad of the job and people she worked with. The more I think about this job, the more I get excited about it. Need to reel myself in as I don't want to put the cart before the horse.

[DukePA]

Go Tilly!!!! Fingers crossed!!

[ArkieDukie]

I can be a huge pessimist at times,just ask K68. I wasn't part of your conversation with your future colleague/boss thus know I am not speaking with any authority whatsoever. That noted, it always concerns me when someone has a "similar" experience, especially if they knew about your bad experience first. They may be trying to empathize with you to lure you in, then show their true colors. You know, the ole switch and bait.

I am not saying this is happening here, I really hope it isn't. I just needed to share the pessimistic side of thinking here.

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

I have a little be of a job thing going myself. I'm applying for a job running the internal medicine residency program at Duke. This program is the largest graduate medical education program at Duke. While I love Surgery, sometimes you need to let go. This new position would be working with just one program instead of trying to manage 4-5. There is a lot of work involved with this, but again, one program. I know the hiring manager, and have known him almost the whole time I've been at Duke and have a really good rapport with him. Will be updating my resume this weekend so I can submit it next week and will be having lunch with the gal who is leaving the position (she saw an opportunity for growth and took it, much like how I'm viewing this) to talk about the good and bad of the job and people she worked with. The more I think about this job, the more I get excited about it. Need to reel myself in as I don't want to put the cart before the horse.

First off, major-league vibes to you for the job with internal medicine!

Thanks for the note of caution, and your point is well taken. I'd like to think you're wrong, but I can't say for certain that you are. Truth of the matter is, I did detect some traits of my ADH boss in the guy at UTMB, and that makes me a bit cautious in dealing with him. The traits I saw are ones that might make him perfectly capable of the old bait and switch. Fortunately for me, I have you to play devil's advocate (all puns intended), and I have the experience with a former boss to make me more aware of the warning signs.

[DukieInKansas]

Good luck with the resume and interview process. They would be getting a gem in you, Tilly!