crazietalk.net

OZZIE4DUKE wrote:

ArkieDukie wrote:I had a conversation with a co-worker that I thought was pretty telling. She came into the office, laughing, after a meeting with PHB and a campus power player.

Do you like this coworker? Is she a friend? Are you going to clue her into the bigger picture with PHB and his SOP (leaving out your job search efforts at this time, of course)? Or just let her figure things out on her own until you are leaving?

I do like this co-worker, but she is not aware of my current job situation - unless PHB has filled her in. She's one of the elite people involved in the cancer project and is a current pet of sorts. With that being said, I think she recognizes the ways of PHB. I will fill her in after the fact if she asks.

I also heard recently that PHB has promised this co-worker a technician to help her with her work. I learned this because she was complaining at lunch one day that PHB had promised her some help but hadn't come through with it yet. I suspect that there's a small matter of needing some salary money to be freed up (**cough**mine**cough**).

ArkieDukie wrote:I had a conversation with a co-worker that I thought was pretty telling. She came into the office, laughing, after a meeting with PHB and a campus power player. PHB met with my co-worker before this meeting, and he flat-out told her that her job was to present ideas to this person and take any criticism so that PHB wouldn't look bad to the power player. As you may recall, one of my chief complaints about PHB during the whole mess with PPI and Minion was that he would throw me under the bus if PPI didn't like my results, even if I had done exactly what he told me to do. This revelation puts the many apparent 180 shifts regarding my data analysis in a whole new light.

It also leads me to believe that what I thought to be absent-mindedness from PHB is intentional. Successes are his; mistakes are the fault of the people beneath him. In other words, he is always good cop and the target du jour is bad cop (usually me). He has absolutely no problem whatsoever with throwing his employees under the bus to make himself look better. Is it just me, or is this wrong? Has anyone else had to deal with this type of behavior before? Granted, hopefully I won't have to deal with it for too much longer, but I'd really appreciate advice on how to best handle this during my remaining time in the lab. Is it something I should bring up in the letter I will be sending to Human Resources upon my departure, or will they view his behavior as acceptable?

ETA: It also lends some support to my theory about why PHB is so mad at me regarding the infamous manuscript. I still think I was being set up to be the fall guy in case anyone called BS on their work. Now it's squarely on him.

Wait, you work for Roy Williams?

DukieInKansas wrote:

ArkieDukie wrote:I had a conversation with a co-worker that I thought was pretty telling. She came into the office, laughing, after a meeting with PHB and a campus power player. PHB met with my co-worker before this meeting, and he flat-out told her that her job was to present ideas to this person and take any criticism so that PHB wouldn't look bad to the power player. As you may recall, one of my chief complaints about PHB during the whole mess with PPI and Minion was that he would throw me under the bus if PPI didn't like my results, even if I had done exactly what he told me to do. This revelation puts the many apparent 180 shifts regarding my data analysis in a whole new light.

It also leads me to believe that what I thought to be absent-mindedness from PHB is intentional. Successes are his; mistakes are the fault of the people beneath him. In other words, he is always good cop and the target du jour is bad cop (usually me). He has absolutely no problem whatsoever with throwing his employees under the bus to make himself look better. Is it just me, or is this wrong? Has anyone else had to deal with this type of behavior before? Granted, hopefully I won't have to deal with it for too much longer, but I'd really appreciate advice on how to best handle this during my remaining time in the lab. Is it something I should bring up in the letter I will be sending to Human Resources upon my departure, or will they view his behavior as acceptable?

ETA: It also lends some support to my theory about why PHB is so mad at me regarding the infamous manuscript. I still think I was being set up to be the fall guy in case anyone called BS on their work. Now it's squarely on him.

Wait, you work for Roy Williams?

Document and stay out of the crossfire.

I've worked with people like that...in fact my current boss tried to take credit for something I had done...so in a meeting when technical questions were asked by higher ups I didn't answer them, I looked at him (questions which, if he had done any of the work, he would have known cold). The frantic look he gave me was priceless. I did a Mr. Spock eyebrow raise at him and let him stew until he had to admit that I was the go-to on the project and had actually done the work. I did tell him afterward I didn't care if he gave the TEAM credit for my work...but to try and shine his own Ass?? Not so much.

As to telling HR on your way out about PHB...my experience has been...they don't care. Unless he's doing something that could lead to a lawsuit most HR departments will turn a blind eye.

windsor wrote:Document and stay out of the crossfire.

I've worked with people like that...in fact my current boss tried to take credit for something I had done...so in a meeting when technical questions were asked by higher ups I didn't answer them, I looked at him (questions which, if he had done any of the work, he would have known cold). The frantic look he gave me was priceless. I did a Mr. Spock eyebrow raise at him and let him stew until he had to admit that I was the go-to on the project and had actually done the work. I did tell him afterward I didn't care if he gave the TEAM credit for my work...but to try and shine his own Ass?? Not so much.

Way to tie him in a knot, Windsor!

I've had stuff like that happen to me too and hate it. Reaks of insecurity and baffles me that "those people" can't see that you actually "shine brighter" and get a better rep AND get more done when you GIVE credit vs. taking it.

Well done.

-EarlJam

windsor wrote:Document and stay out of the crossfire.

I've worked with people like that...in fact my current boss tried to take credit for something I had done...so in a meeting when technical questions were asked by higher ups I didn't answer them, I looked at him (questions which, if he had done any of the work, he would have known cold). The frantic look he gave me was priceless. I did a Mr. Spock eyebrow raise at him and let him stew until he had to admit that I was the go-to on the project and had actually done the work. I did tell him afterward I didn't care if he gave the TEAM credit for my work...but to try and shine his own Ass?? Not so much.

As to telling HR on your way out about PHB...my experience has been...they don't care. Unless he's doing something that could lead to a lawsuit most HR departments will turn a blind eye.

This is excellent, windsor. I must try your approach.

Have I mentioned lately that I want to be like you when I grow up?

An interesting situation arose at work last week; I meant to mention it earlier and forgot. So, remember I mentioned earlier that Minion and PHB were working on a project for which they would need my help? Well, Minion and PPI were chatting with me on Friday before their meeting with PHB, and Minion mentioned to me that she wanted to stop by after her meeting with PHB because she had some questions about the data analysis that she's doing. I pulled a disappearing act and managed to be gone when their meeting was over. However, I'm quite sure this is going to come up again - like, say, tomorrow.

As all of you can imagine, I have absolutely no desire whatsoever to help that backstabber. By going behind my back and getting PHB to allow her to change my work, she made it more than abundantly clear that she has no respect for me or my professional opinion. At least, that's what her actions say to me. If she comes to ask for my help, I'd really like to tell her that and also tell her to look up the definition of "consequences" and/or "karma." If I do this, of course, she will go straight to PHB and whine to him. Fun approach #2 would be to haul her into PHB's office and have this conversation in his presence - after all, he supported her actions. "I'm sorry, but I won't be able to help you" is nice, simple, and straightforward as well.

Truth of the matter is, I've worked with her enough to know how it will all play out: she'll ask for my help, she won't like the answer I give her, so she'll get PHB's permission to do it the way she wanted all along. I'm simply refusing to be the middle man. Would love to hear some good ideas on how to deal with this. Is there any way I can get out of it without getting myself in huge trouble? (Remember, although all signs are good, I have no firm job offers on the table yet.)

Clarification: Taking your time away from the PHB project (and devoting time to Minion's project) is or is not part of your job, right? It would have to be approved by PHB, right?

I would help her. Badly. Slowly. Repeat questions for clarification...generally make it so freakin’ painful that she gives up. That's option 1.

Talk over her head. Use your best 'chem-speak' to be as confusing as possible. If she asks you to explain do not dumb it down...and look aghast that she doesn't understand. You have to help, but at least you can be entertained. That's Option 2.

Help...but take copious notes on exactly what you are doing. In fact “I want you to document everything you discuss and any analysis you assist with”. There, now if she wonders what you were doing you can honestly say “I was asked to document my involvement in the analysis”. If she asks who asks the honest answer is “it isn’t important” (oh, if you guys could just see my evil grin right now ).

Be as unavailable as you can get away with. Can you see her calendar on Outlook? If so, make sure and go looking for her when you know she’s occupied. Send an e-mail saying you are free at time x, time y and time z to help her (use the word HELP) – what time is good for her and copy PHB.


Whatever you do, if you end up assisting, given the past history, summarize what YOUR answers were (and why) using a 'just to clarify' or just to summarize...the copy PPI, PHB and yourself.

Have faith that the day will come when you can sing out loud and proud

"Ring-a Ding Ding Ding Ding Blow it Out Your Ass"

windsor wrote:Have faith that the day will come when you can sing out loud and proud

"Ring-a Ding Ding Ding Ding Blow it Out Your Ass"

This may be the single best closing of a post that I have ever seen on CTN.

I had to deal with it before I read the responses above. I told her she needed to talk to PHB.

The situation is even worse than I thought: The Minion is not doing the analysis. Her Minion (Minion of Minion) is doing the analysis. If anything, he's an even bigger idiot than she is. And the analysis he's doing is MORE challenging that the analysis that she completely botched. Minion is wanting to ask me questions and then relay the answers back to MOM. After, I'm sure, filtering the answer to lower the quality of the analysis.

This is SO not my problem. Yeah, I think PHB needs to deal with this one.

ArkieDukie wrote:I had to deal with it before I read the responses above. I told her she needed to talk to PHB.

The situation is even worse than I thought: The Minion is not doing the analysis. Her Minion (Minion of Minion) is doing the analysis. If anything, he's an even bigger idiot than she is. And the analysis he's doing is MORE challenging that the analysis that she completely botched. Minion is wanting to ask me questions and then relay the answers back to MOM. After, I'm sure, filtering the answer to lower the quality of the analysis.

This is SO not my problem. Yeah, I think PHB needs to deal with this one.

If PHB tells you to help Minion, I would suggest documenting any conversation you have with Minion. After you lend your expertise, send her an email outlining what was discussed. You can tell her in the email that you are just documenting the steps in case she has additional questions at a time you aren't available since you don't want to hold up her work waiting for you to be available for follow-up questions.

Yep, this needs to be shoved onto PHB's desk. Let him sort it out. Windsor, as usual, is right on the money. Your plate is full and you're already overscheduled, so this new assignment on top of your current workload will obviously take much looonnnger than expected. With this new minion person, you have a great chance to mix it up. First request for help, explain the analysis quickly and with as much complexity as possible. If he says, "I got it" and he clearly doesn't, then he can go right over the cliff. If he's all "Say what?', then you can give him a look that says "wait, this is the easy stuff - wait until it gets hard..." In either case, you then go verry sloooowly and start with "Big A, little a, what begins with A? Aunt Annie's alligator, A A A..." And stall. Reschedule meetings, cancel at the last minute, etc.

One point worth adding: MOM barely speaks English. The Minion normally converses with him in Chinese.

ArkieDukie wrote:One point worth adding: MOM barely speaks English. The Minion normally converses with him in Chinese.

In that case...speak quickly, mumble and use as much slang as you can

ArkieDukie wrote:One point worth adding: MOM barely speaks English. The Minion normally converses with him in Chinese.

I think I know what Arkie wants for Christmas.

Lavabe wrote:

ArkieDukie wrote:One point worth adding: MOM barely speaks English. The Minion normally converses with him in Chinese.

I think I know what Arkie wants for Christmas.

Rosetta Stone?

lawgrad91 wrote:

Lavabe wrote:

ArkieDukie wrote:One point worth adding: MOM barely speaks English. The Minion normally converses with him in Chinese.

I think I know what Arkie wants for Christmas.

Rosetta Stone?

I laughed so hard I snorted!

CathyCA wrote:

ArkieDukie wrote:One point worth adding: MOM barely speaks English. The Minion normally converses with him in Chinese.

I think I know what Arkie wants for Christmas.

Rosetta Stone?

I laughed so hard I snorted!

Careful. EJ's gonna want some!

windsor wrote:

ArkieDukie wrote:One point worth adding: MOM barely speaks English. The Minion normally converses with him in Chinese.

In that case...speak quickly, mumble and use as much slang as you can

The "Pass it off to PHB" strategy appears to have worked.

I look at it this way: I'd answer The Minion's question, she wouldn't like my answer, and she'd get PHB to agree with her and tell her how smart she is. I removed myself from the equation.