Student lack of attendance at today's football game

[Very Duke Blue]

I read Rolvix statement OV. He's such a good kid. If anyone hasn't read it, you need too. I'm proud to have Robbie on CTN and to know him.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

I have called the Duke students schmucks twice in two different posts in the last hour. No infractions or negative comments yet, but I'm pretty sure they're coming... one or the other or both. Maybe only the negative comments from one of the schmucks (that's the students, NOT the mods ).

[Very Duke Blue]

I have called the Duke students schmucks twice in two different posts in the last hour. No infractions or negative comments yet, but I'm pretty sure they're coming... one or the other or both. Maybe only the negative comments from one of the schmucks (that's the students, NOT the mods ).

I'm still ticked off I can't post over there. It's a technical thing that's the problem. No one took the time to help me get back on. I did ask. Jerks.

And I do mean the mods.

[allen]

Until yesterday, I never heard of the Tailgate for the undergrads. Is it university/athletic department-sponsored? If there are loads of students just hurling drunk, it sounds like a public policy/public health issue waiting to explode. That HAS to be frustrating, but that still doesn't excuse the athlete's comment.

I'm sure after a well publicized death due to alcohol poisoning the university will take prompt action.

[allen]

I never missed a single home football game during my undergraduate years at Duke. Not one.

I never missed a Duke-UNC football game during my undergraduate years at Duke. I traveled to Chapel Hill when we played there.

I think it would be nice to give priority seating at basketball games for those students who stay for the entire football games. It would take a double swipe of their ID cards (entry and exit). Not having to camp out for a good basketball seat (place to stand?) would be a nice tradeoff, and would reward those who come to cheer for football.

I realize that there are other sports at Duke, but I'm limiting my discussion of the issue to the revenue sports.

To add more emphasis to your point - there are no other sports as big. Adding in walk-ons and red shirts the football team represents 100 students. There are only 6000 undergrads at Duke. 1 of every 60 students is on the football team. This should be about more than supporting your school's team - it is supporting your own friends and classmates. It is quite possible that a student does not know anybody on the volleyball team, or the basketball team, or the fencing team - but given the numbers how could you not know somebody on the football team? There were more Duke players than Duke students.

[DevilWearsPrada]

Very disappointing looking at the Student section on Saturday. Just the Marching band, and the girlfriends and a few of their friends of the football team.

All of the cheering, came from the Wallace Wade Crusties!!! I know I cheered the entire game, and we were dancing and slinging the pompoms. Just trying to get onto the Jumbotron!

Growing up and going to Duke Football and Basketball games with my family, we would get DRESSED UP... like my Dad would have on a shirt and tie, sweater or sweater vest, and sport jacket. I would wear a (colder weather) suede or leather skirt, boots and nice blouse or sweater set. We would go to the game, and go out to eat and go shopping. It was an all day event. (with the exception of weekday Basketball games). But always dressed up to go to games.

We went regardless of how well the teams were doing that season.

The early Coach K years, were not that good, but people went to the games!!!

I think it is very disrespectful for the Undergrads and Grad students, to not go to the Football game. Especially the Undergrads. With such a small university, these Football players are living in the same dorms, apartments, in class together, and walk the same campus, and share the same commuter buses around campus. Their peers should go and show support of their fellow classmates.

[Rolvix]

Haha thanks VDB

Here is my post for those of you that don't want to go "over yonder"



Points against student turnout:
1) ZERO winning seasons since 1994. I was two years old.
2) HUGE drinking/tailgating culture that has taken the place of Football. Sadly the administration won't do anything about tailgate because of the incredible outrage that would take place if they got rid of it.
3) Believe it or not, 85% of Duke students are out-of-state (AND Duke is a schoolwork-intense university). That means a vast majority of the freshman have NEVER followed Duke sports, much less Duke Football. What incentive do they have to spend their Saturdays watching a football team that hasn't been to a bowl in decades? Believe it or not, especially freshman year, Duke takes a solid amount of adjusting in terms of time management and studying. I would say probably 1/5 of the people I know go to tailgate and the other 4/5ths spend their Saturdays catching up on lost sleep or mountains of work. I'm one of the few who make a real effort to make it to the games (actually all of them that I've been here for).

Points FOR attending games:
1) Tailgate actually sucks. For real. Unless you like swimming in beer.
2) Coach Cut is the real deal. The only problem is that most students don't know that yet.
3) Football, win or lose, is FUN. My favorite game all season (didn't attend the UVA game today sadly) was the Alabama game, just because of the atmosphere. Who cares that we lost badly? I can't ever remember Wallace Wade being that loud before.

I completely agree with all of you "Crusties" (I guess? I don't like that term haha). The turnout is absolutely pathetic and I feel TERRIBLE for the football players. Then again, I can see it from the student perspective as well. There are literally thousands of other time-consuming things that would be much more beneficial for students to participate in (like sleep, or work). I know, you'll argue that so many students are out there tailgating. Sure. That's like what, MAYBE 800 people? Out of an undergraduate population of 6000? It's definitely a problem that's probably not going to change without consistent winning record/bowl game seasons. I hate to say it, but those are the thoughts/views from a student/life-long Duke fan perspective. I grew up in NC as a Duke fan and have always supported Duke, even when UNC was winning BBall National Championships and sweeping us.

I try my best to get my friends to go to the game with me. I really think/hope this point will be moot by my senior year. We ARE going to improve. We already have. The culture will start to shift eventually. Even if it doesn't shift AWAY from tailgate, it will shift TOWARDS football - meaning that students who don't participate in either will begin coming to football games.

Just give it some time! I know it's frustrating!

[DukeUsul]

I disagree with a lot of the sentiment directed to the students in this thread.

I wish more students went to games. I wish more students cared. I wish more students liked football. I wish more students would rather enjoy a good game than getting blitzed on a Saturday afternoon and looking like an idiot doing it.

But to say that it's disrespectful or disgraceful or "schmucky" of them to not go to football games is ridiculous. If it's disrespectful or disgraceful for them to not go to a football game, then I was just as disrespectful when I didn't go to a women's golf match or a Hoof n' Horn show or an Orchestra concert. To say that they're schmucks for not coming out to support their football playing classmates means that I must have been a schmuck for not going to see my classmates on the women's golf team or my acquaintances in the orchestra perform. If people aren't interested in football then it's up to the University and athletic department to attract people who are - by making the football experience better - the students have no obligation to come to the game. Football is NOT the reason most students come to Duke, so to denigrate them for not coming out to it isn't appropriate.

To denigrate the students for getting wasted at noon on Saturday IS appropriate.
To call that dude a schmuck for wearing a neon green singlesuit IS appropriate.
To call the students disgraceful for walking around stumbling, puking drunk in front of my toddler IS appropriate.

Man I hope I don't get a zillion negative spork points for this.

[Lavabe]

I disagree with a lot of the sentiment directed to the students in this thread.

I wish more students went to games. I wish more students cared. I wish more students liked football. I wish more students would rather enjoy a good game than getting blitzed on a Saturday afternoon and looking like an idiot doing it.

But to say that it's disrespectful or disgraceful or "schmucky" of them to not go to football games is ridiculous. If it's disrespectful or disgraceful for them to not go to a football game, then I was just as disrespectful when I didn't go to a women's golf match or a Hoof n' Horn show or an Orchestra concert. To say that they're schmucks for not coming out to support their football playing classmates means that I must have been a schmuck for not going to see my classmates on the women's golf team or my acquaintances in the orchestra perform. If people aren't interested in football then it's up to the University and athletic department to attract people who are - by making the football experience better - the students have no obligation to come to the game. Football is NOT the reason most students come to Duke, so to denigrate them for not coming out to it isn't appropriate.

To denigrate the students for getting wasted at noon on Saturday IS appropriate.
To call that dude a schmuck for wearing a neon green singlesuit IS appropriate.
To call the students disgraceful for walking around stumbling, puking drunk in front of my toddler IS appropriate.

Man I hope I don't get a zillion negative spork points for this.

For every negative spork you receive, I'll give you a couple of positive sporks!!

As for Allen's 1 in 60 students is on the football team statistic... I never met a one when I was an undergraduate. I was in Stonehenge and Central Campus. Zero. In my classes were NONE, nada, nill, zero. Seriously. They weren't part of my world. I couldn't recognize them if I bumped into them on the street. I wonder if there were frats/dorms and classes where most of the team tend to congregate. Is it the same today?

Allen: I agree completely with your comment and smilie:

I'm sure after a well publicized death due to alcohol poisoning the university will take prompt action.

I still wonder how calling students schmucks, or just plain old saying that you hate all of them, helps advance the cause of increasing student attendance at football games.

[CathyCA]

I disagree with a lot of the sentiment directed to the students in this thread.

I wish more students went to games. I wish more students cared. I wish more students liked football. I wish more students would rather enjoy a good game than getting blitzed on a Saturday afternoon and looking like an idiot doing it.

But to say that it's disrespectful or disgraceful or "schmucky" of them to not go to football games is ridiculous. If it's disrespectful or disgraceful for them to not go to a football game, then I was just as disrespectful when I didn't go to a women's golf match or a Hoof n' Horn show or an Orchestra concert. To say that they're schmucks for not coming out to support their football playing classmates means that I must have been a schmuck for not going to see my classmates on the women's golf team or my acquaintances in the orchestra perform. If people aren't interested in football then it's up to the University and athletic department to attract people who are - by making the football experience better - the students have no obligation to come to the game. Football is NOT the reason most students come to Duke, so to denigrate them for not coming out to it isn't appropriate.

To denigrate the students for getting wasted at noon on Saturday IS appropriate.
To call that dude a schmuck for wearing a neon green singlesuit IS appropriate.
To call the students disgraceful for walking around stumbling, puking drunk in front of my toddler IS appropriate.

Man I hope I don't get a zillion negative spork points for this.

I didn't call the Green Unitard guy a schmuck. I did say that he wore a "silly ass costume." And I did say that stuffing paper where his equipment should have been was silly.

And FWIW, he DID make it over to the concourse of Wally Wade, which is more than I can say for the students who managed to get up at the butt crack of dawn, put on silly ass costumes, and then wander almost over to Wally Wade to drink themselves into oblivion, only to return home without so much as a simple cheer for the team.

BTW, when I was at Duke, the football players were among the coolest people on campus. We wanted to be able to say to them at parties on Saturday night, "Oh boy! That 35 yard touchdown in the closing seconds of the game was spectacular!" I suppose I'm an old fuddy duddy and I don't understand the cultural shift on campus.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Since I'm too lazy to retype...here is my latest response to this issue OY.

Last night I wrote to the guy who's FB status started this thread (he has removed that post) and he wrote back an informative response.
It sounds to me that this past weekend really opened some eyes across the board, and it's an issue that has been recognized by those with the power to initiate change. Cutcliffe not only addressed it to the media, but he shared his dissapointment with the team. It appears the writing is on the wall for the end of the tailgate..and if that is true that means positive action is finally being taken.
I'm on a bit of a mission to email as many folks up top to offer what ideas I can, and we've got some great ones posted so far. It also makes sense to gather thoughts of the students (as well as players which I've already started doing), so any of you who are students, (on this board that equals one..but some of you are recent enough to be relevant to their point of view) please PM me or even better share them openly with the board. Nothing changes if nobody initiates change. Maybe it's a windmill I'm up against, but I'm willing to charge ahead and give it a shot.

[captmojo]

I read Rolvix statement OV. He's such a good kid. If anyone hasn't read it, you need too. I'm proud to have Robbie on CTN and to know him.

I read it also and agree with you. He is wise beyond his years.

ps: I re-read it here, also.

[CameronBornAndBred]

I read Rolvix statement OV. He's such a good kid. If anyone hasn't read it, you need too. I'm proud to have Robbie on CTN and to know him.

I read it also and agree with you. He is wise beyond his years.

ps: I re-read it here, also.

Good writing is worth reading twice!

[OZZIE4DUKE]

Since I'm too lazy to retype...here is my latest response to this issue OY.

Last night I wrote to the guy who's FB status started this thread (he has removed that post) and he wrote back an informative response.
It sounds to me that this past weekend really opened some eyes across the board, and it's an issue that has been recognized by those with the power to initiate change. Cutcliffe not only addressed it to the media, but he shared his disappointment with the team. It appears the writing is on the wall for the end of the tailgate..and if that is true that means positive action is finally being taken.
I'm on a bit of a mission to email as many folks up top to offer what ideas I can, and we've got some great ones posted so far. It also makes sense to gather thoughts of the students (as well as players which I've already started doing), so any of you who are students, (on this board that equals one..but some of you are recent enough to be relevant to their point of view) please PM me or even better share them openly with the board. Nothing changes if nobody initiates change. Maybe it's a windmill I'm up against, but I'm willing to charge ahead and give it a shot.

Hear hear! Go get em, tiger! I'll let you get the ball rolling, let me know how I can help. I haven't had time to call White or Brodhead as I said I was going to do OY. Prolly won't tomorrow, either.

[CameronBornAndBred]

It appears the writing is on the wall for the end of the tailgate..and if that is true that means positive action is finally being taken.

Well BH was right...and it happened a lot sooner than I expected. Looks like it is cancelled for the BC game.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

It appears the writing is on the wall for the end of the tailgate..and if that is true that means positive action is finally being taken.

Well BH was right...and it happened a lot sooner than I expected. Looks like it is cancelled for the BC game.

Good for the administration! Brodhead finally got some balls!

[Rolvix]

Straight from the man himself:


Dear students,

Last Saturday, many of us enjoyed a terrific, hard fought victory over Virginia in Wallace Wade Stadium. I want to acknowledge the tremendous effort of our team and wish more students could have been on hand to celebrate this win. Unfortunately, the positive experience in Wallace Wade was dampened by an incident in tailgate...an incident involving a teenage youth which easily could have been tragic.

This incident has vividly revealed that tailgate as is practiced at Duke must come to an end. It has long lost its value as a pre-football, spirit building activity and has become increasingly dangerous in every iteration. Thus, there will be no student 'tailgate' this Saturday in advance of the game against Boston College.

Over the spring, we will work with students, Athletics and many others to develop a new form of football game day celebration....one that will support our student athletes, be safe and healthy, and showcase the pride of "Dear Old Duke". We will invite your ideas and suggestions and be prepared to celebrate the fall 2011 season with the class and spirit for which Duke is known.

But, before we focus on next year, we have critical games ahead and need your full support of our team. I really hope that you'll all turn out and cheer on the team to a win over Boston College. With the UNC game over Thanksgiving weekend, this will be the last time this year for most of you to show your support. Please join us in Wallace Wade this Saturday!

Larry Moneta
Vice President for Student Affairs

[Rolvix]

And my respone to Mr. Moneta:



Dear Mr. Moneta,

It is tragic that it takes dangerous incidents to catalyze the change of something that could easily be considered one of the most dangerous activities "approved" by the administration. As a freshman in the class of 2014 and a lifelong Duke fan I fully support the action you and your fellow administrators are taking to shift this "culture" towards a safer, spirit-focused activity. There is no need for students to be participating in this event, partially because there are plenty of other opportunities for undergraduates to "express themselves" over the weekend, and partially because it has almost completely destroyed any football student fan base.

As a resident of North Carolina, someone who participated in a student led "tailgating club" in high school, and someone who has frequently attended both ECU and UNC football games/tailgates over the past four years, I was shocked to learn what a "Duke Tailgate" entailed. I've had many discussions with both friends at other universities and alumni of Duke about the fact that there is no legitimate tailgate at Duke. I would absolutely love to cook out for three or four hours before a game, eat, share quality time with my friends, and get pumped up for the game at hand. Duke football is changing. I know that students don't necessarily realize that yet, but as a long-time fan and follower I can tell a significant difference in the football program now that Coach Cutcliffe is here.

If you need any advice or help from an undergraduate student who would look to promote a good ol' fashion tailgate, I would love to be of service. I'm not particularly sure what you would need me to do, nor that you would need me at all, but I could suggest ideas or even perhaps help plan tailgating events. I know that you will be receiving dozens - perhaps hundreds of emails criticizing your decision to cancel tailgate, but you should know that your decision is supported at least by a few.

Thank you for making a step in the right direction,
Rolvix (Robbie) Patterson

[CathyCA]

And my respone to Mr. Moneta:



Dear Mr. Moneta,

It is tragic that it takes dangerous incidents to catalyze the change of something that could easily be considered one of the most dangerous activities "approved" by the administration. As a freshman in the class of 2014 and a lifelong Duke fan I fully support the action you and your fellow administrators are taking to shift this "culture" towards a safer, spirit-focused activity. There is no need for students to be participating in this event, partially because there are plenty of other opportunities for undergraduates to "express themselves" over the weekend, and partially because it has almost completely destroyed any football student fan base.

As a resident of North Carolina, someone who participated in a student led "tailgating club" in high school, and someone who has frequently attended both ECU and UNC football games/tailgates over the past four years, I was shocked to learn what a "Duke Tailgate" entailed. I've had many discussions with both friends at other universities and alumni of Duke about the fact that there is no legitimate tailgate at Duke. I would absolutely love to cook out for three or four hours before a game, eat, share quality time with my friends, and get pumped up for the game at hand. Duke football is changing. I know that students don't necessarily realize that yet, but as a long-time fan and follower I can tell a significant difference in the football program now that Coach Cutcliffe is here.

If you need any advice or help from an undergraduate student who would look to promote a good ol' fashion tailgate, I would love to be of service. I'm not particularly sure what you would need me to do, nor that you would need me at all, but I could suggest ideas or even perhaps help plan tailgating events. I know that you will be receiving dozens - perhaps hundreds of emails criticizing your decision to cancel tailgate, but you should know that your decision is supported at least by a few.

Thank you for making a step in the right direction,
Rolvix (Robbie) Patterson

Robbie, you rock!

[CameronBornAndBred]

That's 150% awesome Robbie.